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 BMW M1 Physics

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Jukka Närhi
Frank Verplanken
Alberto Ibañez
Carlo Pozzi
Guillaume Siebert
Tiago Malafaya
Steve Parker
Carl Larrad
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Carl Larrad
Racing Legend
Carl Larrad


Number of posts : 6751
Age : 59
Location : Swindon , UK
Registration date : 2008-12-20

BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeFri 1 Oct 2010 - 20:19

Before release i would really like to have a safety car this has eluded me
i just cant seem to get one to show up in the game .....

I Have tried changing the search path in the pacecar file but still all i ever get is the Alimpo Sport car
which seems to show up as the default safety car ... :hum:

I Would really like to paint a pace car that looks more like a pace car ...Any Ideas anyone scratch
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Alberto Ibañez
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Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeFri 1 Oct 2010 - 21:12

I never took a look at that scratch

Was there any specific car model that was used as Pace Car back then? I have never seen one in F1/PROCAR footage or pictures ...

Also, there's another question: Is this going to be an HSO repack of the 1980 season, or a full revamp of the former mod, including 79-80 seasons? Since the physics are valid for both seasons, and since both you Carl and I are former members of the BITDT team (And apparently the only currently active ones), I suppose it would be OK to release a full update with all goodies added by 3rd parties later (The excellent revised 3D model and new sounds). What do you think, Carl?



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Carl Larrad
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Carl Larrad


Number of posts : 6751
Age : 59
Location : Swindon , UK
Registration date : 2008-12-20

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeFri 1 Oct 2010 - 21:43

Yes this will be a Full 1979/80 M1 repack we used the New model earlier on HSO to race the 1980 season this year but i never released to the General public so when we release it will be the first time the public have seen the new model ....And The Much improved Physics ....

A lot of extra cars are also included which where not in the original Rfactor/F1 Challenge mod ...

The rework on the model was done by a guy called JuJU who as far as i know is know working on the HistoriX mod ...
he also included the excellent Supra lights which work great with the M1 ....

I Tried to get the Orange Porsche to work from the 1979 F1 Mod as i would have thought that the procars would haves used the same pace/saftey cars as the F1 cars...Ive Even got full permission to use there porsche model in our mod but i just cant get it to show up ingame .....

As you can see from the pic Someone managed to do it but i have lost contact with them ....

BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Porsch10

Just realised that perhaps BITDT is not dead after all mate :drink:
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Tiago Malafaya
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Tiago Malafaya


Number of posts : 3384
Age : 46
Location : Porto, Portugal
Registration date : 2008-10-05

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 3:01

Carl Larrad wrote:
Just realised that perhaps BITDT is not dead after all mate :drink:



Really glad to hear it m8 :clap:
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Alberto Ibañez
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Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 9:25

I just took a look and found that the Pace car Porsche is in a Classes="2005 PaceCar NO_AI"

It's directly copied from the F1 1979 mod, but actually I have never seen it work in the F1 mod either...

I will take a look at the CART98 mod, and see how they did set up the pace car. Maybe that gives me an idea or two...

Quote :
Just realised that perhaps BITDT is not dead after all mate :drink:

Ahmen to that cheers

[EDIT]

Just as I supposed, there is apparently something wrong with the Pace Car in both F1 and PROCAR mods, for starters they are in the wrong folder (Pace cars should go to Pace car folder in Vehicles) and while the CART 98 Toyota Pace Car shows up in the game correctly and you can buy and drive it (Just select "All tracks and vehicles" and you will see a category "Pace Car") the Prosche doesn't. I will check further and see if I can configure it correctly.
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Alberto Ibañez
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Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 9:47

OK I think I got it now ... can you send me the Porsche files so I can try to implement it? I just noticed that the mod comes by default with the original rFactor Pace car.

If it works I might use them as a fix for the F1 1979 missing pace car :champ:
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Carl Larrad
Racing Legend
Carl Larrad


Number of posts : 6751
Age : 59
Location : Swindon , UK
Registration date : 2008-12-20

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 10:24

I Have sent the Pacecar to you by email
Good Luck Mate Wink
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 14:00

Received, thanks!

Will report when I have it working ...
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 14:57

OK, problem solved, the Pace Car Porsche is now working :champ:

The championship files (.RFM files in RFM folder) were lacking the needed parameters for the Pace Car to act etc. I'll upload for you the corrected files along this weekend.
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Tiago Malafaya
Racing Legend
Tiago Malafaya


Number of posts : 3384
Age : 46
Location : Porto, Portugal
Registration date : 2008-10-05

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 17:39

Attention to detail...... That's what I like to hear :top:
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 20:19

Hey I was educated in a german school, so I'm a friggin perfectionist ... otherwise I would not have come back so many years after, to finish the M1 Physics properly LOL lol!

I have been doing some wreck-racing runs, and the Pace Car works perfectly. It isn't even too intrusive, you need to wreck a car in an escape area or in the track centre to have it appear. :cowboy2:

Now I'm going to do some test runs regarding fuel consumption. If the M1 was a gas guzzler in reality (5 mpg OMG!), I want it to be like that in the mod. Should make an interesting compensation of lost weigth (fuel) vs. tyre degradation along the race.

Oh, and also I want to see what is happening with the starting engine sounds :hum:

[EDIT]

Well for those of us who drive on the right side of the road, 5 mpg is ... 47 l / 100km affraid

Good thing that fuel in rFactor is free LOL

[EDIT2]

Well, surprisingly enough I had already scripted a fuel consumption rate that was even higher! Now I have reduced it to the correct value. :clap:
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Ludovic Tiengou
Racing Legend
Ludovic Tiengou


Number of posts : 2986
Age : 56
Location : Grenoble far away from Brittany, France
Registration date : 2008-12-12

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSat 2 Oct 2010 - 21:43

Alberto Ibañez wrote:


[EDIT]

Well for those of us who drive on the right side of the road, 5 mpg is ... 47 l / 100km affraid

Good thing that fuel in rFactor is free LOL



well that's nothing compair to fuel consumption HCGT gave to the Mini Copper S. Depending on how you get the revs it's between 80 and 100 l/100 kms. Not bad isn't it for a small 1.2L. Something get really odd there as it's more between 20-25 in race conditions.
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Steve Parker
Racing Legend
Steve Parker


Number of posts : 2000
Age : 65
Location : England uk
Registration date : 2008-12-22

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 0:33

Just managed to get some time to test the latest version,and it is superb Alberto :drink: only thing it needs is maybe fraction more engine braking,took it round monaco and was in 1.42s first 3 laps :top:






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Carl Larrad
Racing Legend
Carl Larrad


Number of posts : 6751
Age : 59
Location : Swindon , UK
Registration date : 2008-12-20

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 9:13

Alberto Ibañez wrote:
OK, problem solved, the Pace Car Porsche is now working :champ:

The championship files (.RFM files in RFM folder) were lacking the needed parameters for the Pace Car to act etc. I'll upload for you the corrected files along this weekend.
OMG I Tried everything and i never even thought of looking into the rfm folder ,
i might just have to give the litte porsche some new paintwork Wink

So we should be able to delete the other 2 pacecar files that are in the m1 folder
as they dont appear to do anything ....

Well done mate
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Carl Larrad
Racing Legend
Carl Larrad


Number of posts : 6751
Age : 59
Location : Swindon , UK
Registration date : 2008-12-20

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 9:17

Nice lap at Monaco Steve
love the flat out
shut your eyes and hope run through the Chicane :top:
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 10:10

Fantastic lap Steve, and it could have been even quicker, had you not had one of those hair-rising moments where you almost lost the rear. Excellent car control, and and as Carl says, big eggs going almost flat out (3/4 throttle from the sound?) through the chicane after the tunnel. No wonder that chicane was made much slower later for safety reasons ... gulp!

Quote :
So we should be able to delete the other 2 pacecar files that are in the m1 folder
as they dont appear to do anything ....

Actually we can make a good simplification of folder structure; there is one "Procar" folder too much currently. The mod should install all the main files and teams to:

rFactor\GameData\Vehicles\ProCar

and then the Pace car goes into:

rFactor\GameData\Vehicles\Pace Car

The Pace car folder in rFactor was purposedly added to include there all pacecars of any mod, and so keep them separated from the rest of vehicles, while at the same time allowing to share them between various mods, in case of need. Adding the proper code lines to the F1 1979 mod RFM files we can easily share the Pace car with the F1 one.

I'll try to pack the files and send them to you tonight.

Quote :
i might just have to give the litte porsche some new paintwork

Oh yes, please do it :clap: Do you have already any paint scheme in mind?

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Steve Parker
Racing Legend
Steve Parker


Number of posts : 2000
Age : 65
Location : England uk
Registration date : 2008-12-22

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 10:41

lol! was flat out through the chicane,the gearing was on the lowest final drive,the next setting final gear was too long hehe,so i was on rev limiter going through chicane,will try middle set again and try it flat out,still needs a bit of engine braking imho
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 10:50

Ahh that's the reason I was hearing a different sound tone, probably the rev limiter...

Mmmm I guess I should make the short gearing a bit longer then. The time you will gain making the chicane flat out will compensate the one you will lose in acceleration, so eventually the car will be the same or a bit slower. Changing one teeth should suffice.

I have been looking at the engine file and I can't figure out how to add engine braking. There is an adjustable parameter, so I might as well allow it to be adjustable. I guess that probably this was an available parameter as well in real life. And of course, an aspirated 3.5 liter with that huge compression ratio should have a noticeable braking when off throttle. In fact, looking back at the videos I linked above, you can see that when reducing before corner entrance the driver almost loses the rear twice. Probably wheels nearly locked, I guess.

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Carl Larrad
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Carl Larrad


Number of posts : 6751
Age : 59
Location : Swindon , UK
Registration date : 2008-12-20

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 11:35

I Also noticed the file structure is all over the place its a real mess so
we could do with sorting that out could never understand
why we have 2 procar folders one inside another .....

Dont know who was responsible for that but its weird how its ended up like that ....

I Have a few ideas for the repaint i love the HSO Colours
but it would be nice if we could put BITDT on there somewhere
although this is not essential ......
I Like the HSO idea As i think the Guys from HSO have helped out a great deal with this ....

I Know its not historically correct but What do you think ....

Where nearly there know .... :clap:

Did i happen to mention that you guys are great lol!
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 11:59

Yes I agree. You can also combine several logos, f.e. the //M1 in big and then spread evenly below it "HSO-BITDT". Whatever you do, I'm sure it will look great mate BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 12028

[EDIT]

Oh, and what about the tracks? If we don't want to engage the additional task of a track pack with proper permissions, then at least we could provide in a separated, optional pack the artwork for the loading screens and track map, all with the M1 PROCAR theme, what do you think about that? A combination of a nice PROCAR action picture with the historic advertisement poster -as used here at HSO when announcing each round- and logos would be great.
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Steve Parker
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Steve Parker


Number of posts : 2000
Age : 65
Location : England uk
Registration date : 2008-12-22

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 13:32

Alberto try these engine braking settings in the engine file see what you think,i think its almost spot on,just tested it and feels superb




EngineBrakingMapRange=(0.0, 0.0, 0) // input throttle is ranged from minimum to 100%, with the minimum = setting * step * RPM,
EngineBrakingMapSetting=2 // the default is 1 * 0.000133 * 15000 RPM = 2% applied throttle at zero input throttle
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Steve Parker
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Steve Parker


Number of posts : 2000
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Location : England uk
Registration date : 2008-12-22

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 16:17

was just trying a different sound,also you can see extra engine braking,as long as you get revs right downshifting,or else you lock rears up .

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Alberto Ibañez
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Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 17:06

I have tried the new engine braking and I like it! Certainly, it is now much more noticeable, and wild gear reductions will lock the rear wheels BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 12028

However, the engine sound in the video .... Suspect pig
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Carl Larrad
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Carl Larrad


Number of posts : 6751
Age : 59
Location : Swindon , UK
Registration date : 2008-12-20

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 17:27

Steve sorry i have to agree with Alberto on this one
i love the bark of the old engine ....
I Dont think its 100% accurate but When you turn up the sound it goes right threw you .... :raclure:

Know if we could use the BRM V16 engine that would be amazing ONLY JOKING ... :hihi:

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Alberto Ibañez
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Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 121
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

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PostSubject: Re: BMW M1 Physics    BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 Icon_minitimeSun 3 Oct 2010 - 17:36

I have found some more interesting info about the PROCAR here: http://8000vueltas.com/2007/11/27/m1-procar-y-bmw-lmr-v12-en-la-bmw-world-final

Basically, the web owner was at the track day organized by BMW in Valencia/Cheste circuit (OMG that's where I live, if only I had known) and talked with Felix Porteiro, after he drove the M1 around. His impressions: It's teh slowest car on the track (Compared with the 320iS, the M3GTR and the V12 LeMans), but by far the most difficult to drive. He said that reductions required a very polite heel and toe technique, and that failing to do it was very delicate because rear differential was locked in a 100% and hence the rear axis was VERY live when braking.

I'm currently revising the championship files to ensure the points system is correct BMW M1 Physics  - Page 7 788525

BTW I have seen that no other than Tiff Needell also jumped once into a PROCAR! I have a picture of him -sideways, how else?- LOL
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