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 [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]

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Tiago Malafaya
Antoine de Mautor
Martin Audran
Richard Coxon
finally gone :)
Frank Verplanken
Alberto Ibañez
Austin Johnson
Mike Becnel
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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeSun 12 Jan 2014 - 20:28

Round 2 for the SCCA championship will be held as a co-race with the IMSA series. Recall that this is a double points event for SCCA but you can also score championship points in the IMSA series with your car.

You will likely need a co driver. Driver swap procedure for rFactor here.

Race details here.

Note for now there is no minimum distance requirement to score SCCA points. That will change for the next enduro race. If you combine with another SCCA driver in his or your car (like Alberto and I will) your points will transfer to you as a driver, not to the car. Alberto, no need to 1 lap your car. You must be within the same class and I must approve the car temporary move. This will count as one of your three moves but can be repeated without additional charges.

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[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] 458


Last edited by Mike Becnel on Sat 18 Jan 2014 - 17:27; edited 2 times in total
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Austin Johnson
Pro Driver
Austin Johnson


Number of posts : 814
Age : 33
Location : Northern California
Registration date : 2013-01-14

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 5:33

ill be racing  :conduit:  just hope a can get a teammate.

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"The Winner ain't the one with the fastest car, it's the one who refuses to lose." Dale Earnhardt. [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] 559
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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 14:36

Round 3 at Riverside will be posted after the IMSA Enduro is completed. Training server will come up the Monday after at the latest.

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[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] 458
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 120
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:01

Quote :
This will count as one of your three moves but can be repeated without additional charges.
 
In events where all cars run together like Road Atlanta, there are actually two races going on under two different sets of rules, one is the IMSA race and the other the SCCA. Some cars score in the two (SCCA cars because IMSA accepts them) some only in one (IMSA cars because SCCA does not accept them).
 
I will be switching from the IMSA point of view from the regular 911 to the Pontiac for enduros where I partner you, and another move will be when I do the New Hampshire four hours solo on the Cuda. That's from the IMSA perspective however, and hence only affects the points scored in the IMSA.
 
As for my participation in the SCCA, the rules do not specify wether I can or not codrive a car, they only say I can't switch car except under exceptional circumstances. Thus you either
 
a) consider the enduros one of those exceptional circumstances and rule as legal codriving a different car. In which case there will be no limit of how many times you can change to other car in the enduros (Because IMSA rules do not apply for SCCA and anyway you are applying the "exceptional cirumstances rule" and not the "Three moves" one), or
 
b) you ban the possibility of changing between SCCA cars for the enduros and request a 3rd party driver from outside the series.
 
It also should be noted that:
 
Quote :
HSO admins alone are qualified to solve any problems raised by the application and the interpretation of the present regulations.
 
And because a loophole is tecnically something different than the application and interpretation of rules (You can't apply anything or interpretate where there isn't anything regulated before), you can't do that unless you change the rules by adding new ones for that loophole.

CONCLUSION:

I can switch as codriver between SCCA cars as many times as I want in enduro races, or else everybody needs to seek 3rd party codrivers right now  :langue: 
 
 :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:  :regl:

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[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Ik0uEqBjC0LKiLMueGfA
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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:10

IMSA cars do not count as one of your switches :D

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[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] 458
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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 120
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:17

In IMSA they count because 911, Firebird and Cuda are all IMSA cars.
 
In SCCA there is no rule limiting switches
 
 :jp:

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Frank Verplanken
League Owner
Frank Verplanken


Number of posts : 13288
Age : 47
Location : Nice, France
Registration date : 2008-09-08

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:18

Well it's a very minor point you bring up, but every driver participating in IMSA races must stick to the IMSA rules, whether they run an IMSA or SCCA car. SCCA cars are invited and score points for both their championship and one of the two IMSA series, but this is an IMSA race we're talking about. So you can do whatever you want as long as you don't drive more than three different cars in the IMSA races of the year, whether they are IMSA or SCCA cars. As for the SCCA rules of course we'll tolerate a change of cars from your regular SCCA drive to another SCCA car for an Enduro.

All of this was implied in the rules and only your interpretation of the said rules lead you into believing they had a loophole, which they don't  :hihi: Razz

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Last edited by Frank Verplanken on Mon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:20; edited 1 time in total
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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:19

geek My brain hurts.

Long story short, I doubt we will have any issues with car swapping in SCCA but if someone goes bananas with switching they may find themselves slightly restricted.  Twisted Evil 

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finally gone :)
Racing Legend



Number of posts : 3192
Age : 30
Location :
Registration date : 2008-10-27

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:22

Ok Philippe, la prochaine fois, je change d'équipier. Je me trouverai plutôt un avocat pour gérer toutes ces histoires de règlement, ca sera plus simple :hihi: 

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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:25

JP Campmajo wrote:
Ok Philippe, la prochaine fois, je change d'équipier. Je me trouverai plutôt un avocat pour gérer toutes ces histoires de règlement, ca sera plus simple :hihi: 

We have a 365 day a year hunting season in Texas for lawyers.  :cowboy2: 

Unfortunately, they are difficult to field dress and usually lacking any useful substance.  :jp: 

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Frank Verplanken
League Owner
Frank Verplanken


Number of posts : 13288
Age : 47
Location : Nice, France
Registration date : 2008-09-08

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:28

lol! Well they can't all be Oscar Zeta Acostas or Saul Goodmans :D

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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 120
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:33

Quote :
As for the SCCA rules of course we'll tolerate a change of cars from your regular SCCA drive to another SCCA car for an Enduro .... All of this was implied in the rules and only your interpretation of the said rules lead you into believing they had a loophole, which they don't

Nope, the SCCA rules do NOT mention that changing of cars for enduros would be allowed "of course", they say "under exceptional circumstances". So you either consider the enduros "exceptional circumstances", or you have a loophole.

And now comes the question: How can you afirm that the year enduros are "exceptional circumstances" when you had them planned from the beginning in the schedule?

If the rules are issued at the start of the season they are made to comprise all known situations, and hence the reference to "exceptional circumstances" precisely for those things that can't be foreseen. But the year schedule CAN be foreseen, and therefore you CAN'T actually consider the enduros to be comprised into a rule conceived for something else.

P.D.

And I'm not a lawyer in real life  Wink 







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Richard Coxon
Racing Legend
Richard Coxon


Number of posts : 16590
Age : 35
Location : Sheffield, England
Registration date : 2012-06-29

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 15:46

scratch  I'm Confused a little, Anyway just mentioning i am NOT running my Javelin in this race.

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Frank Verplanken
League Owner
Frank Verplanken


Number of posts : 13288
Age : 47
Location : Nice, France
Registration date : 2008-09-08

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 16:09

Alberto Ibañez wrote:
And now comes the question: How can you afirm that the year enduros are "exceptional circumstances" when you had them planned from the beginning in the schedule?

We never said enduros are "exceptional circumstances". Exceptional circumstances rather refer to a driver's wish to change of car and the multiple reasons why he could want to do that, and the multiple reasons why we would or would not allow the change Smile .

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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 16:27

[quote="Alberto Ibañez"]
Quote :


And I'm not a lawyer in real life  Wink 


But you play one on TV (convincingly!)


Alberto, the rules you have been quoting are there to keep massive car changes which results in nightmarish scoring problems for us.

1. Take a Prozac
2. Take a really strong stiff drink
3. When you wake up in 48 to 72 hours clean up the mess then stop worrying about all this  :D 

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Alberto Ibañez
Racing Legend
Alberto Ibañez


Number of posts : 16788
Age : 120
Location : International Simracing Organisation
Registration date : 2010-09-17

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 18:27

Well anyone thinking I was serious about all this nonesense should really feel pissed off now  Laughing  but the point I wanted to make clear is that if we start playing with the rules here things can become annoying real fast. And I hadn't even started with the real shit, trust me  Wink 

What I like about HSO is the spirit of being here for the clean fight, not for points, podiums or any kind of honors other than having enjoyment and providing it to our fellow racers. I do not want the forum to turn into one of those leagues we all know where people are fighting all day round about anything, but I hope the admins take note of how quickly this shit can spread in front of the ventilator -which was the whole point of this all.

P.D: Ha ha ha ... I got you on this one :D 


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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 18:39

Alberto Ibañez wrote:
Well anyone thinking I was serious about all this nonesense should really feel pissed off now  Laughing  but the point I wanted to make clear is that if we start playing with the rules here things can become annoying real fast. And I hadn't even started with the real shit, trust me  Wink 

What I like about HSO is the spirit of being here for the clean fight, not for points, podiums or any kind of honors other than having enjoyment and providing it to our fellow racers. I do not want the forum to turn into one of those leagues we all know where people are fighting all day round about anything, but I hope the admins take note of how quickly this shit can spread in front of the ventilator -which was the whole point of this all.

P.D: Ha ha ha ... I got you on this one :D 


Your 1st stint is 4 hours Sunday  :aie: lol! 

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Martin Audran
League Owner
Martin Audran


Number of posts : 5553
Age : 37
Location : Vannes, France
Registration date : 2008-09-08

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 18:50

I don't really see how someone could eventually "play" with the rules as we are the one making and applying them. If someone come here and ask for some silly things because "it's not precisely forbidden in the rules", we could and will say no of course. If it's a reasonable request we will always think about it.

We know our rules are by far not exhaustive, but there is no need for them to be because we always have the last word. And if we wanted them to be exhaustive, they would be, I studied a lot the law in the university so I know how it works ^^  Wink 


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Antoine de Mautor
League Owner
Antoine de Mautor


Number of posts : 3617
Age : 34
Location : Nantes, France
Registration date : 2008-09-08

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 21:40

Putain Martin ton anglais  affraid study :top: 

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Mike Becnel
Racing Legend
Mike Becnel


Number of posts : 4741
Age : 54
Location : Sugar Land, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-24

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 22:21

Never made the connection between Poontang and Putain...until now. Thank you for today's back alley French lesson Antoine  lol! 

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Tiago Malafaya
Racing Legend
Tiago Malafaya


Number of posts : 3384
Age : 45
Location : Porto, Portugal
Registration date : 2008-10-05

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeMon 13 Jan 2014 - 23:22

Mike Becnel wrote:
Never made the connection between Poontang and Putain...until now.

 lol! 

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Luca Franca
Rookie



Number of posts : 3
Age : 31
Location : Cattolica
Registration date : 2013-08-26

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: inscripition!   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeWed 15 Jan 2014 - 1:25

hello guys i m writing from Italy :D i talk for our team Mennato Boffa Sim Racing, where we can download the track? thanks a lot Smile

Team: Mennato Boffa Sim Racing
1-Franca Luca
2-Boffa Vito
3-Lamonaca Gabriele

Car: testing
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Frank Verplanken
League Owner
Frank Verplanken


Number of posts : 13288
Age : 47
Location : Nice, France
Registration date : 2008-09-08

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeWed 15 Jan 2014 - 2:24

Mennato Boffa Cool one of the all-time Sicilian greats !

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Martin Audran
League Owner
Martin Audran


Number of posts : 5553
Age : 37
Location : Vannes, France
Registration date : 2008-09-08

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeWed 15 Jan 2014 - 4:14

Antoine de Mautor wrote:
Putain Martin ton anglais  affraid study :top: 

C'est sérieux ou quoi ? :aie: 

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Ben Paulet
Racing Legend
Ben Paulet


Number of posts : 8291
Age : 48
Location : Cagnes sur mer France
Registration date : 2009-07-29

[2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Empty
PostSubject: Re: [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th]   [2014] Round 2 - The Road Atlanta 6 hours [Jan 19th] Icon_minitimeWed 15 Jan 2014 - 13:17

Mike Becnel wrote:
Never made the connection between Poontang and Putain...until now. Thank you for today's back alley French lesson Antoine  lol! 
 lol! 

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